|
New Canon Tidbits
| |
| Jace_Varitek | Date: Thursday, 23 Jul 2015, 0:16 AM | Message # 1 |
 Commander
Group: Administrators
Messages: 180
Status: Offline
| So today at work I was actually paid to read Tarkin for 2 hours because there was nothing else to do, and I picked up some new canon details that I thought I'd share with everyone here. Until all the bits and pieces of new canon are better-known and -understood, I think the neighborly thing to do would be for people to post their observations on this thread for everyone to see. For example:
As of 14 BBY, all clone troopers had long ago been phased out.
It's strongly implied that there are no clone stormtroopers, and that clones from the Grand Army of the Republic were long ago phased out of service.
The title of Moff didn't exist during the Clone Wars.
According to the old canon, Moffs were created during the Clone Wars to act as military governors, similar to Moffs in the ancient Sith Empire. Presumably, this has now been tossed out the window. Now, the Empire introduced the title at the end of the war, and Tarkin was one of, if not the first.
Imperial officers rarely wear their medals or campaign ribbons.
It's frowned-upon.
A character exists named Lieutenant Thon.
Thooooooooooooon!!!
A Moff is a Governor.
Tarkin is a Moff but is referred to as Governor, just as he later is in A New Hope. The titles of Moff and Regional Governor are probably the same thing. However, it's not clear what Tarkin is a Moff or Governor of, exactly. He doesn't seem to govern any specific territory.
Droid starfighters are virtually unheard of.
5 years on from the end of the Clone Wars, droid starfighters have practically disappeared from the galaxy.
Hacking the Holonet is equally rare.
Specifically, slicing the Holonet to make it broadcast doctored footage or images is rare indeed and seems to require a lot of organization and resources to pull of.
It's implied that TIE Fighters are brand new as of 14 BBY.
The TIE fighters seen early in the book are referred to as "newly-minted." The wording suggests not simply that those specific TIE fighters are "newly-minted," but that the design itself is. However, this is perhaps 20% speculation on my part.
Droid starfighters do self-destruct automatically.
The novel Outbound Flight introduced us to the idea that droid starfighters would self-destruct when they lose contact with the droid control signal. Tarkin confirms that this is, indeed, still the case.
Jace Varitek
Former Jedi Padawan
Pilot of the gas tanker Taloraan Sunrise
|
| |
|
|
| Karth·DeQora | Date: Thursday, 23 Jul 2015, 0:29 AM | Message # 2 |
 Officer
Group: Users
Messages: 54
Status: Offline
| - Starkiller no longer exists (Yay!) and the Rebel Alliance was formed by Bail Organa with aid from Ahsoka Tano, the characters from Star Wars Rebels and the Rebellion was in its early stages as of 5 BBY.
- RZ-1 A-Wings also now exist as of 5 BBY and were in use by the Rebellion by then.
- Lightsabers all contain a force-emitting crystal known as a Kyber Crystal (which I guess is the new term for what we just called saber crystals). The Death Star's superlaser is actually powered by these same crystals and destroying one creates a powerful blast wave.
- Depa Billaba didn't go nuts during the Clone Wars, she trained and sacrificed herself to save Freddie Prinze Jedi.
- As of 5 BBY there are still other Jedi (that we don't see directly) hiding throughout known space.
- The Empire apparently has a naval academy on Mandalore, now.
This is just what I remember off the top of my head from Rebels and reading a few of the new 'canon' articles on wookieepedia.
Karth De'Qora, Fugitive Jedi
"It is good to have an end to journey toward; but it is the journey that matters, in the end." ~Ernest Hemingway
Message edited by Karth·DeQora - Thursday, 23 Jul 2015, 0:44 AM |
| |
|
|
| Jace_Varitek | Date: Thursday, 23 Jul 2015, 5:14 PM | Message # 3 |
|
Commander
Group: Administrators
Messages: 180
Status: Offline
| A few more from Tarkin:
There's a branch called Naval Intelligence.
We've already known that Imperial Intelligence is now being referred to as Military Intelligence, but that poses more questions than it answers. Tarkin mentions both Military Intelligence and also Naval Intelligence, and both of the names are capitalized suggesting to me that they're separate organizations. But again, this is about 20% speculation on my part.
Coruscant isn't always called Imperial Center
The Empire did indeed rename the planet "Imperial Center," which as far as I'm aware is one of the few carry-overs from Timothy Zahn's books so far. But more often than not, it's still referred to as Coruscant even by some of the highest-ranking Imperials.
A young Wilhuff Tarkin won the Hunger Games
Well, more of a one-man Hunger Games on Eriadu in which he mainly just killed animals and ate their livers. Now, you might say, "But Jace, that doesn't sound like something the stately Sir Peter Cushing would do." No, indeed it doesn't. What are you thinking, James Luceno?
"Hyperspace nausea" is a thing.
Who knew?
Lommite is re-canonized.
Lommite ore was mentioned in a previous book by James Luceno. It's used in the manufacture of transparisteel, is apparently quite valuable, and seems to be found on just a handful of planets on the Outer Rim. Shipments of lommite to the Core Worlds are a juicy target for pirates.
The Outland Regions Security Force is re-canonized.
The book refers to the history of Eriadu basically as we already know it from the previous canon. Not surprising, considering Eriadu and the Outland Regions Security Force are mentioned in several other James Luceno books, since most Star Wars authors are apparently incapable of restraining themselves from self-referencing their work.
(Then again, I've been packing my RP posts full of references to Star Wars: Legends and A Galaxy At War, so I shouldn't complain).
The Imperial Palace was built around the Jedi Temple.
I'm not actually sure about this, since it directly contradicts the 2004 re-release of Return of the Jedi in which the Jedi Temple is seen during the celebrations on Coruscant exactly as it appeared in the prequels. Moreover, I think we see both the Imperial Palace and the Jedi Temple separately during that celebration scene. We should probably check in on this one from time to time to see if any changes are made.
I'm about 20% of the way through Tarkin so I'm sure I'll have a lot more of these facts to come. Also, thank you Karth for contributing the facts from Rebels, which I still haven't seen yet.
Jace Varitek
Former Jedi Padawan
Pilot of the gas tanker Taloraan Sunrise
|
| |
|
|
| Gigantic_J | Date: Thursday, 23 Jul 2015, 8:56 PM | Message # 4 |
 Ensign
Group: Moderators
Messages: 17
Status: Offline
| I will say this about Wookieepedia; for once it is not the usually airtight source it used be. As we must right now for RP purposes, there is a degree of supposition that must be done for things to make sense; especially in matters where it seems to be a clear carry over of Legends concepts. The unfortunate thing is sometimes this is wrong or leads to the wrong idea. One must tread carefully on canon matters as it will take some time for things to make sense again. But supposition must be done carefully.
A case in point is the issue of Moff. Tarkin is Moff of Greater Seswenna by the way, and also in charge of the Death Star; until he is promoted to Grand Moff and is given authority over the entire Outer Rim. Yes, Outer Rim. Specifically, Outer Rim. Moff are indeed referred to as governors. They run things called sectors. There are only twenty of them at 14 BBY. You will notice that twenty is also the number of oversectors created under the Republic during the Clone Wars in Legends and the names of such have been carried over thus far in their mention. What does that mean? Are there only twenty sectors in the entire galaxy? No. The sectors developed by Legends and completely (partially) by the online enhancements of The Essential Atlas still exist (in that they have so far been used appropriately. There's still an Arkanis Sector in which Tatooine sits; there is still a Chommell Sector in which Naboo sits. The oversectors of the Republic from Legends also exist (in that they have also been used appropriately). Greater Seswenna still exists largely in its original form.
The annoying thing with canon now is that terms are vastly interchangeable. The Outer Rim can refer to the Outer Rim we've always known, or it can mean an informal term for the Outer Rim and Mid Rim (Naboo is mentioned as both an Outer Rim and Mid Rim planet). The Core can refer to the Core Worlds we've always known, or an informal designation of the rest of the galaxy. Sector can refer to the sectors as we have always known them, or to the oversectors of the Clone Wars in Legends.
Another interesting thing to take note of is the upcoming game Star Wars: Uprising. The game is set solely in the Anoat Sector (See? Another old sector. It's the same old sector). The primary villain of the game is Adelhard. In all the advertising and game info thus far, he is explicitly mentioned as Governor Adelhard, not Moff Adelhard. While indeed it is a yet to be released game, so it is supposition, but it is interested that they are mentioned him as Governor rather than Moff. Confused yet?
We will have to fight something over the next few years, and that is the instinct to disregard certain works due to the medium in which they are presented. In the past the order generally went: films/tv -> novels -> comics -> reference books -> games -> other. The official order is: films/Lucas -> tv ->novels/comics/reference/games (story only), etc. -> non-canon -> detours. Essentially the first three tiers tied together into a single canon, and any disputes were settled by going by the higher canon. The third tier however often had many conflicts, many of which were never settled. One of the greatest things about now is that all of that doesn't matter.
Now, everything is one neat and tidy canon. The junior novel Moving Target: A Princess Leia Adventure, The Force Awakens, Tarkin, Star Wars: Uprising, and Star Wars Battlefront* will all have the same level of canonical authority. The * is there on Battlefront due to the continuing rule that in games events and stories depicted are canon, but the mechanics of the game are iffy to a degree. Is a Y-Wing being able to bomb an AT-AT canon? Yeah, I'd say so. Did Luke have a lightsaber duel with Vader in the middle of the Battle of Hoth? No.
What's the point of all of this? Canon is hard.
Jaron
Canon Master of The Will of the Force
|
| |
|
|
| Gigantic_J | Date: Thursday, 23 Jul 2015, 8:57 PM | Message # 5 |
|
Ensign
Group: Moderators
Messages: 17
Status: Offline
| And Karth is partially right on the state of the Rebels in 5 BBY. The rebels depicted by Rebels in 5 BBY are only now part of a larger cell, not the Rebel Alliance itself. The Rebel Alliance's formation is yet to be depicted canonically.
Jaron
Canon Master of The Will of the Force
|
| |
|
|
| Davon·Vanden | Date: Thursday, 23 Jul 2015, 9:07 PM | Message # 6 |
 Officer
Group: Users
Messages: 41
Status: Offline
| Right, by the Alliance I meant the Rebel cell we've seen, but since Organa was one of the founders of the Rebellion in the old canon, I felt it was a safe assumption. It's probably going to be him and Mothma as the two main founders.
Davon Vanden
Navigator of the Aphelion
|
| |
|
|
| Geoff_Cole | Date: Thursday, 23 Jul 2015, 10:34 PM | Message # 7 |
 Ensign
Group: Users
Messages: 13
Status: Offline
| I would like to point out that, even in canon, there are at least 2 examples of Moffs listed as governors, and one who, apparently, served in the navy and patrolled around. Not to mentioned the LGBPT Moff they made to pander to the gay community.
Geoff Cole
Moff, Abrion Sector
|
| |
|
|
| Jace_Varitek | Date: Thursday, 23 Jul 2015, 10:42 PM | Message # 8 |
|
Commander
Group: Administrators
Messages: 180
Status: Offline
| There's a huge amount of confusion about Moffs, but the main problem is this: a Moff is a Governor, but might be a Sector Governor or might be a Regional Governor. We don't know. So the fact that two Moffs are referred to as Governors isn't helpful.
Jace Varitek
Former Jedi Padawan
Pilot of the gas tanker Taloraan Sunrise
|
| |
|
|
| Jace_Varitek | Date: Thursday, 23 Jul 2015, 10:44 PM | Message # 9 |
|
Commander
Group: Administrators
Messages: 180
Status: Offline
| To add to the confusion, a Moff of a "Sector" might be referring to a Sector, or could be loosely-referring to an Oversector. The reason we think it might refer to Oversectors is because there are twenty Moffs in Tarkin, and previously there had been twenty Oversectors during the Clone Wars. This suggests that a Moff is a Regional Governor in charge of an Oversector. And that a Sector Governor is in charge of an individual sector, such as the Abrion Sector.
Jace Varitek
Former Jedi Padawan
Pilot of the gas tanker Taloraan Sunrise
|
| |
|
|
| Geoff_Cole | Date: Friday, 24 Jul 2015, 1:11 AM | Message # 10 |
|
Ensign
Group: Users
Messages: 13
Status: Offline
| "Ssaria was a human female who served the Galactic Empire as a Moff and as the Governor of Castell."
"She rose to the rank of Moff and ruled as Governor of Castell and its surrounding sector."
Specific instances in which, from my understanding of what you are saying, canon contradicts itself. Clearly, Moff Ssaria is a sector governor.
Also:
"Abran Balfour was a Moff in the Imperial Navy. He patrolled the Llanic Spice Route and the Triellus Trade Route in the Llanic system in the Outer Rim Territories."
A Moff who patrols trade routes?
Geoff Cole
Moff, Abrion Sector
|
| |
|
|
| Jace_Varitek | Date: Friday, 24 Jul 2015, 2:31 AM | Message # 11 |
|
Commander
Group: Administrators
Messages: 180
Status: Offline
| Continuing from here. So, if the point is that the canon is messed up to such an extent that we don't know what a Moff is or does, I'm not going to disagree with you. In my opinion, that's simply all the more reason to be conservative and use the ranks we know and understand until the Moff discrepancy is cleared up.
However, that's just my opinion. I'm not emotionally invested in this, and personally I think that's one of the strengths of my opinion on the matter. But I also think it would be hard-headed of me not to defer to those who feel more strongly about it than I do. So, having really just not anticipated that there would be strongly-held opinions about whether a character is referred to as Moff or as Governor, I'll opt for the path of least resistance and stipulate that a Moff can be in charge of a Sector.
Again, I don't agree with this and I'm doing it against my better judgment. But, lacking enough information to interpret the canon at the present time, I'm not going to stand in the way of what certain people obviously very strongly want.
Jace Varitek
Former Jedi Padawan
Pilot of the gas tanker Taloraan Sunrise
|
| |
|
|
| Geoff_Cole | Date: Friday, 24 Jul 2015, 3:15 AM | Message # 12 |
|
Ensign
Group: Users
Messages: 13
Status: Offline
| Maybe it's just me, or because I'm actually on the spot, I suppose, but, even drawing, if I may, from non-canon sources, the rank of 'Governor' was usually held by an Imperial-appointed civilians, or one locally voted in with Imperial sympathies in mind. 'Moff' has always struck me as a far more militaristic term; the rank of someone with the ability to actually command military respect and troops, or fleets. I mean, one can't expect your average Imperial 'governor' to simply know what's best in a battle, or how to combat rebels. He's great at raising taxes, giving speeches and skimming off the top for himself (until Vader finds out and kills him, of course). However, Moff just seems more in line with a sector governor than just 'governor,' which, even precluded by 'sector' just doesn't seem to carry the same weight.
Like I said, it may just be me, though.
Geoff Cole
Moff, Abrion Sector
|
| |
|
|
| Jace_Varitek | Date: Friday, 24 Jul 2015, 3:25 AM | Message # 13 |
|
Commander
Group: Administrators
Messages: 180
Status: Offline
| I don't disagree.
Jace Varitek
Former Jedi Padawan
Pilot of the gas tanker Taloraan Sunrise
|
| |
|
|
| Jace_Varitek | Date: Friday, 24 Jul 2015, 10:56 AM | Message # 14 |
|
Commander
Group: Administrators
Messages: 180
Status: Offline
| Okay so here's some more:
Robes are all the rage.
Because the Emperor makes the ascetic black robe look so good.
Ars Dangor, Sate Pestage, and Janus Greejatus are still canon.
That's right, everyone's favorite trio of creepy old men who dress like 1980's British pedophiles are back on the Imperial Ruling Council. Who braids their moustache, really?
Palpatine doesn't get out much.
Palpatine isn't interested in the day-to-day running of the Empire. So much so that empty motorcades are sent around Coruscant to give the impression that Palpatine is busy doing things.
The Joint Chiefs are a thing.
I hate to see such an America-specific real-world term used in Star Wars, but the Joint Chiefs are mentioned frequently and might even be replacing what we used to call High Command, since the term High Command hasn't been mentioned once.
Who knows what a Moff is anymore?
Tarkin is referred to as a Sector Governor, but as of about halfway through the book it still hasn't said specifically what sector he's the governor of. To make matters worse, the term Sector Governor seems to be used synonymously with his duties as a base commander, which shouldn't have anything to do with one another. Unless he's in charge of the Arkanis Sector where Sentinel base is located? Oh, the humanity!
Naval Intelligence is definitely a thing.
It's called the Naval Intelligence Agency and seems to jockey with the Imperial Security Bureau for jursidiction.
Jace Varitek
Former Jedi Padawan
Pilot of the gas tanker Taloraan Sunrise
|
| |
|
|
| Gigantic_J | Date: Friday, 24 Jul 2015, 4:24 PM | Message # 15 |
|
Ensign
Group: Moderators
Messages: 17
Status: Offline
| I'm not sure what's wrong with a gay Moff, but oh well. To each their own.
Jace is compacting my words to tiny bits. A Moff has always held an informal title of Moff, which we see with Tarkin, but have seen done with a few others throughout Legends. But they were always described as a Moff and only addressed as a Governor in dialogue, with I think a few rare exceptions. An oversector is still a sector, just a bigger one. The line "Regional Governors" by Tarkin has always been taken to mean the Moffs; the only change we see now is that the canon has reinterpreted the regional bit to be an oversector rather than sector based authority. This is why we are seeing specific mention of a sector Governor in the Uprising information.
I realise I may be beating a dead horse, but it is far better to limit ourselves to what we know is canon, and expand later, rather than expand and then find ourselves backed into a corner when the canon disagrees with our decision. For example, Cole is allowed to be a Moff in charge of just the Abrion Sector. But Tarkin says there are only twenty Moffs. What if the material coming out in September also says the there are still only twenty Moffs or that a sector governor, of a sector like the Abrion Sector, is a Governor not a Moff. What then? We clearly have a discrepancy with canon, and this is a canon RP. That's a severe issue, which requires something to be taken away and RP to be modified.
This is part of the process, ladies and gentlemen. Things will change, old things are going to be reused as new thing. It's part of the experience of Star Wars now. It's going to take take for there to be more than supposition added to a majority of the conversation. Hopefully this will change come September with the official release of Uprising, as well as Aftermath and Shattered Empire.
Jaron
Canon Master of The Will of the Force
|
| |
|
|
|
